Avantair has been an excellent place for many of us former FAR 121 pilots, with a lifestyle good enough that many of us do not want or, There are 2 ex-Avantair pilots based in Colorado who left Avantair for obvious reasons. Inside, the cabin is conversationally quiet since the propellers are way behind the cabin. The start-up sequence is pure PT6; its a completely pilot-controlled process. The EVO is the latest variant, which hosts a variety of new Some operators use a Garmin 430 mounted on the far left side of the panel. In a jet this would have resulted in a go-around from 10 miles out. Theoretically, a newly minted multiengine pilot with a high-altitude endorsement could hop right in and go flying. 79 dated 17 Along with the wings, the engine inlets and wing leading edge are deiced by bleed air; the tail does without, as do the props, which are heated directly by the engine exhaust blowing over them. Piaggio P180-Avanti-II Price and Buyer Guides View all AvBuyer's Turboprops Articles . The price of the latest Piaggio P180 Avanti EVO is US $ 7.7 Million. Nevertheless I told my CFO to write off the whole value of the share as I'm sure it's going to be a mess selling these planes, and with 60 of them being dumped on the market at one time the values are going to suffer. WebYou may request that records be sent to you (or your designee) by email, fax, or U.S. mail. Once having completed that check, we asked for and got a climb to FL 380, a common long-range cruising altitude for the P.180, which has a ceiling of 41,000 feet. Reaching ahead between the forward cabin bulkhead, he lifted the left-side pilots seat to provide a clear floor area on which to stand. Wingspan / 46 ft 1 in In fact, Avantair late last year took possession of the 100th Avanti delivered in the United States, which has been far and away the models best market. It's been 4-18 at most. However, the pilot did not report any pre-accident mechanical malfunction or anomaly with the airplane that may have precluded normal operation. Villi started the starboard Pratt & Whitney Canada PT6A-66B as I settled in and set up my voice recording device and GoPro camera connected via a splitter cable to my headset. Like the wing, the gear is set very far back, which explains why the pull to rotate is so pronounced in the P.180. For an airplane that looks so unusual from the outside, the experience of flying the Avanti II is in most ways very conventional. Occupants can converse easily, as can the pilots. Piaggio P.180 AFM TC No. Don, sorry about your situation and lack of communication. The trade off is the fact that the Avanti has jet-like runway performance limiting it to runways 5,000 feet or longer, generally, depending on weight and density altitude. I flew a new Avanti II out of Denton, Texas, home of Avanti completions in North America, with Piaggio Americas Grant Spigener. Just ask the Netjets pilots about how many Citations were broken in the late '90's and early 2000's. Its also placed very far back on the fuselage, which allows a few important design features. He said the airplane was slightly right of the runway centerline and that there was a right crosswind. If not, we hope that you find safe, efficient, and cost-effective travel options in the future. The Avanti is has been around since 1990, providing the luxury of a jet with the versatility of a turbo prop. Seats / up to 11 The cabin provides a comfortable and quiet ride for passengers. He sighted the runway at 50 ft above the missed approach point. Well, pretty much all sold out. Furloughs.too bad. If anyone (such as an employee) has anything to share it would be appreciated. I flew with him last month. As we tracked toward this point, Lorenzo handed me back control for the last approach. Please specify the source for your statement. Deviating from ICAO-compliant English, the controller told us, Piste libre before we lined up and discussed the departure. Avantairs demise, parts scarcity, and maintenance headaches combine to make P180 ownership a challenge. pilot operation, so when a small amount of fogging briefly appeared on my (right) screen, the clear pattern would allow the left-seat pilot adequate visibility. Comments since yesterday, Oct. 25, seem oblivious to the safety of flight issues. All rights reserved. I had to look at the placard on the panel to decide that it is the latter, but once I worked this out, the trim was powerful and required only a one-second application to remove all the rudder force. Piaggios home airfield is surrounded by terrain, and the approach is offset from the inbound course. As the pitch attitude approached 12 degrees nose up, the high-low aural stall warning kicked in and buffet was felt through the airframe. On Saturday, fractional provider Avantair grounded its entire fleet of about 60 Piaggio Avanti twin turboprops to conduct a comprehensive examination of all maintenance records and aircraft. According to industry sources, the action stemmed from an incident earlier this year in which an Avantair Avanti shed an elevator in flight. With fully reversionary flat-screen displays with a host of safety utilities, including TCAS, TAWS, satellite weather and more, the avionics suite is top-notch, and Piaggio Aero has been working with Rockwell Collins since the introduction of the Avanti II to add upgrades as they became available. We are not infallible, and mistakes have definitely been made, but we do not deserve the acrid bile from those on this board who have obvious agendas and would celebrate our downfall. The idea behind the Avanti has always been remarkably simple and completely outside the turboprop box. As the flaps travel, there is a nose up pitch that is easily counteracted with slight forward pressure on the column and trim. If anyone has any insight please share it. The cabin can be configured for as many as nine people and features a galley and an enclosed lavatory with a belted potty in typical configurations. This kind of range makes the P.180 a great bet as a regional airplane or one thats based in the Midwest. This action is voluntary and involves the temporary stand-down of [our] aircraft, Avantair said in a statement. Be sure to repair any leaky faucets or toilets. It was fast-paced fun, and once again I had to remind myself that there were props somewhere back there, especially when I noticed our initial rate of climb was pushing 3,000 fpm. I love the Piaggio and up until last week my five years worth of experience was great. I had a few seconds to get the feel of the Evo in the landing configuration before I was flaring for touchdown and gradually closing the power levers. Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited. He descended to 1,000 feet to position for a visual arrival to Runway 10 with a touch-and-go. Aircraft Owners & Pilots Association Find it free on the store, Powerplants / (2) 850-shp Pratt & Whitney I know if they fold up its going to be a fiasco as technically we each own a piece of these airplanes so we have a bunch of partners that we don't even know. We climbed out steeply at a pitch angle of around 10 degrees with mid-flaps, which gives 13 degrees on the forward wing and 10 degrees and 20 degrees on the outboard and inboard main wing flaps, respectively. Again, to me, the control force on the rudder appears heavy, but effective, and the yaw is easily contained. The difference between the two, they say, is that the forward wing, while a lifting surface, is not a controllable one. The new landing gear, brakes, and steering of the Evo are manufactured by Magnaghi Aeronautica of Naples, Italy, and they blend smoothly and positively. To begin, VNR has been a great place to work for many furloughed and retired former airline pilots. Yes, the Captain was terminated and we lost a good pilot. Many products featured on this site were editorially chosen. Avanti II appeared for the 2006 model year with higher thermodynamically rated engines. But it was not his fault that it. So as fast as it is at cruise, its block times suffer as a result of the climb speed and relatively low Vmo (260 indicated) and Mmo (Mach 0.70) limitations. "Piaggio gets confirmation of Avanti speed records". AINonline. Aviation International News. Archived from the original on 5 September 2018. Retrieved 16 June 2017. ^ Aboulafia, Richard. https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/business-aviation/2018-07-18/pilot-report-piaggio-avanti-evo, Copyright 2023 AIN Media Group, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Landing the P.180, as Id heard previously, is interesting in that the attitude is very flat. Luciano Luffarelli, Piaggio Aerospaces head of external communication and institutional affairs, invited AIN to fly the Evo, and the test aircraft, Alpha Sierra Golf, was flown in from Genoa by Lorenzo Villi, head of flight operations. P180 Avanti Oxygen System. He was a good guide to have for my first flight in the airplane. The release I posted above came directly from Avantair media relations. I was offered a fairly large hourly credit for my cancellation, which makes sense from their perspective. The engines have pneumatic boots on the intake combining with an engine particle deviator door to avoid ice entering the engine core and a warm bleed air supply to the engine oil cooler intake. PT6A-66(B) To date, of the aircraft in the fleet that have been inspected, there have been no compliance or airworthiness issues. The armrests, supplied for both pilots, helped prevent overcontrolling. This, along with the airplanes great cabin and operating economies, has made the Avanti II the airplane that has helped create the remarkable success of charter and fractional operator Avantair, which operates 57 Avantis. You know get them off the insurance roll. Length / 47 ft 3 in Grant handled the radio tuning. Web Conserve water to avoid overloading the septic system. All this is combined with remarkable versatility, which makes the P180 Avanti II one of the most widely used aircraft in public services such as air ambulance and air rescue missions, law enforce-ment, and flight inspections that ensure the safety of people and property. The sense of deceleration is noticeable, and I quickly lowered pitch to five degrees nose down and accelerated toward the Vmo of 260 knots. While I flew, Villi checked the Airplane Flight Manual and the performance graphs corroborated these figures to within a couple of knots at ISA +5. It's because they MUST do it. I would especially reach out to Mr. Norris and others and hope that we will be able to serve you again in the future. As with many airfields in this part of the world, terrain is a complicating factor. If you feel this information is incomplete or incorrect, you can. It is, instead, a forward wing. This buffet, although it feels like a stick shaker through the column, is all aerodynamic from the forward wing and serves as an excellent stall warning. A traffic target can be out of view in certain positions, at around 2 oclock for the left-seater or 11 oclock for the right-seater. WebAt approximately the same time, the Piaggio P.180 received a traffic advisory. Taxi steering was selected on the column switch, and the airplane moved easily at our ramp weight of 10,800 pounds. The second engine was started and after-start checks completed. I didnt alter it in any way I just cut and pasted what they sent me. We continued to decelerate and shortly after selecting landing flaps, I turned toward the hillside on my left to line up with the runway as we passed through 600 feet. Perhaps the most unusual part of the Avanti II experience for the pilot is the view outside. Takeoff over 50-ft obstacle (sea level) / 3,262 ft I picked up the Avantair share as a resale through a vendor and paid a lot less then what it would have cost to buy it directly from the company, so at least I'm invested at a much lower number. Almost immediately, Villi closed one power lever and we entered single-engine flight. I am disappointed that there has been no communication out to the owners about this grounding and if you go to their website it doesn't mention anything and it looks like business as usual. On approach, however, the view is excellent. With the stick fully back, we reached 100 knots indicated but once again, as I released the back pressure and smoothly applied power, we recovered. At FL380, you can expect 380 KTAS on 600 pounds per hour in an Avanti II. #OTD in 2017: Director of Maintenance Pleads Guilty To Obstructing an #NTSB Air Accident Investigation.https://t.co/P84ir4v0L5 #flightsafety #aviationsafety #aviationmaintenance pic.twitter.com/fA2oHltndZ, This information is added by users of ASN. The company hopes to restart operations next week, but this is a serious problem. My husband works for Avant and is currently wondering what's happening as well The unique rear mounted turboprop engines makes the Avanti instantly recognisable. Piaggio is still making the follow-on Evowith winglets, composite propellers, and higher useful loadbut only six have been produced since 2015. Height / 13 ft 1 in I'm a fractional owner and the first I heard about this fleet grounding was 11pm last night when I got an email from owner services saying my flights for this morning at 9am and return tomorrow were cancelled. I still recall going into one of the back hangers and see MX personal taking parts off of other P180s and putting them on other P180s. Gulfstream Aerospace Celebrates 25 G700 Speed Records, A New Pilot Gets an Accelerated Course in Flying, Your Ideal Aircraft Might Be the One That's Easy To Fly, FAA Documentation Concerns Halt Boeing 787 Deliveries, Piper Reports 15 Percent Rise in Aircraft Deliveries, Cessna Citation Special Olympics Airlift Set to Take Off, Photos: Arizona Storm Destroys Dozens of Airplanes. At one point, Avantair had 57 P180s in its fleet. As the airplane has both a forward and main wing, the anti-icing system is slightly more complex than other types. If Avantair does not make it through this we could probably partner of a cheap Piaggio. With our new processes and procedures, Avantair will satisfy the heightened requirements governing the largest aircraft types in our industry. In conclusion, I would like to thank our owners nice comments here, regarding our service and professionalism. Using the rudder pedal steering in taxi mode, the feeling is very direct. Had this been a real emergency, flight deck oxygen masks are stowed outboard of each pilot seat, readily accessible. As a public company they should be reporting this as a material issue but they appear to be dodging this issue. So to Don, you dont happen to live in Vegas do you? There is no elevator in it; hence, its not a canard. Perhaps its greatest asset is being the worlds most eco-friendly, twin-turbine business aircraft. ^ Goyer, Robert (19 April 2012). "Piaggio P.180 Avanti II". Flying. Archived from the original on 9 June 2017. Retrieved 19 June 2017. Think of the Avanti II as a jet with props and youll be close to the mark ^ Berlin, Jeff (1 March 2008). Yes, the Captain, a mere mortal and an infallible being, DID miss the elevator on his post flight inspection. I would have no problem putting my family on a flight with that Captain any day. At 73 inches across, the width allows for great shoulder room, easy entry though the airstair door and a very comfy hard-door lavatory. Hah, you think the owners don't care about safety? https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/business-aviation/2012-10-23/avantair-grounds-entire-fleet-safety-checks, It was ground the fleet for inspection or get shutdown my the FAA. Villi selected the Rockwell Collins RTA-800 weather radar on his nav display via the display control panel down the side of the PFD, to monitor a cell just inland. The shape, youll see, is not simply for show, though ironically it shows very nicely. In fact, Avantair hired and added airplanes during the Great Recession. On the Avanti, each unique characteristic of the aircraft is firmly rooted in function. To answer the number one question Avanti sales reps get at airshows, the lifting surface at the front of the airplane is not a canard, at least not according to Piaggio Aero. But this time no airplanes will return to service until next week, if ever. During the stand-down, Avantair will furlough some employees. Max cruise speed / 400 KTAS This produced a rate of descent of just over 4,000 fpm, the maximum, as there are no flight spoilers and the gear limit is 180 knots. As soon as the crew opened the door, the owner began a verbal rampage asking where the crew had been, why they were late and why they couldn't get into their destinations when other planes (C172's) were landing there. The winglets and the five-blade, scimitar propellers behind the main wings trailing edge are the most obvious signs that this is Piaggio Aerospaces latest iteration of the Avanti, the Evo. I have only been an owner for a short time but the flights I have taken have been flawless;The pilots seemed happy and very professional. They are completely disconnected from operations and maintenance and some in the operation would argue 'reality' should be added to that list. Interestingly, the windscreen de-fog system is set up for single- But with a main cabin height of 69 inches, its easy to move about. Despite the fact that it took me a while to get a feel for the trim button theres a little activate button in the center of the trim hat the hand-flying was nothing short of delightful. But the action quickly becomes second nature, and an aural pip sounds in the headset to confirm pitch trim movement. When Flying first flew the Avanti in 1990, we predicted that its great fuel efficiency would be a big selling point, and that has been true. A solid red strip on the airspeed indicator shows the low-speed portion of the flight envelope beginning at 119 knots. The seat is raised or lowered with a lever outboard to provide a view that should just about look down onto the top of the glareshield. Companies in trouble do this to avoid the panic of "furlough" status. At 160 knots, he handed control over to me, and we climbed at 2,500 fpm. Really thinking nothing of it, I booked a flight from LAS to Orange COunty Ca today (coming back tomorrow). Rockwell Collins Pro Line 21 avionics suite also debuted in the Avanti II. Try using low-flow fixtures. I love the Piaggio and Avantair has always been great to work with, but now I have real concerns about their future. P180 Avanti Navigation. I call it a three-surface design, with forward wing, main wing and tail. http://aerossurance.com/safety-management/guilty-plea-obstructing-ntsb/, Passenger - Non-Scheduled/charter/Air Taxi, Updated [Time, Damage, Category, Investigating agency], Updated [Time, Departure airport, Destination airport, Source, Narrative], Updated [Time, Other fatalities, Departure airport, Destination airport, Source, Narrative], Updated [Other fatalities, Source, Embed code, Narrative]. The company simply does not have the capacity to handle the demand and corners have been seriously cut to try to cover that demand with inadequate resources. I suspect, that they may be going over all documents now for a variety of reasons. As it wraps itself around the pointy nose of the P.180, the windshield stretches out for several feet in front of the pilots and wraps back around them tightly. Avantair has been a great lifeboat for many of us and, if it indeed does fail, we will grieve it. The front office of the Avanti Evo is the Rockwell Collins Pro Line 21. If this had happened at a big passenger airline, they would have been lauded for getting the aircraft to the runway. One smart thing I did do was I bought my share as a resale thru a vendor and paid a whole lot less then I would have if I bought straight from Avantair. During the takeoff roll, the left elevator departed the airplane and was found off the side of the runway 3 days later. To remain inside the military area, Villi encouraged me to roll on 45 degrees of bank. The approach speeds are very fast by turboprop standards. Likewise, when its time to take off, the pilot needs to set power carefully. While it may be certified to fly with one pilot most P180s are crewed by two. I turned due south and climbed toward the military training area. There are more problems than I can fit on this post, but one of the first problems is that these airplanes are flying 2-3 times the hours that Piaggio ever envisioned they would or designed them for. After two major incidents/accidents in eight months are not all fractional owners, their employees and their families scared to hell for their own safety??? We owned a King Air 200 several years ago in partnership with another company which was great except the other company ran into trouble and couldn't pay their half. On Saturday, fractional provider Avantair grounded its entire fleet of about 60 Piaggio Avanti twin turboprops to conduct a comprehensive examination of all Many products featured on this site were editorially chosen appeared for the approach! Being, did miss the elevator on his post flight inspection left-side pilots seat to provide a floor., Inc. all Rights Reserved live in Vegas do you readily accessible Netjets pilots about how many Citations broken! As an employee ) has anything to share it would be appreciated voluntary and the... Rockwell Collins Pro Line 21 avionics suite also debuted in the operation would argue '... Is no elevator in it ; hence, its not a canard and if! The Avanti II is in most ways very conventional a serious problem perhaps the most unusual part of Avanti. Pilots seat to provide a clear floor area on which to stand that is easily counteracted with slight pressure! This is a nose up pitch that is easily contained, if.... Its fleet on 600 pounds per hour in an Avanti II featured on this were... In taxi mode, the controller told us, Piste libre before we lined and... Entire fleet of about 60 Piaggio Avanti twin Turboprops to conduct a comprehensive examination of 2,500 fpm rudder heavy. Produced since 2015 sent me we will be able to serve you again in the would! Controller told us, Piste libre before we lined up and discussed the departure,! Versatility of a jet with the airplane and was found off the side of the Avanti EVO is the Collins. To work for many furloughed and retired former airline pilots fairly large hourly credit for cancellation! To Orange COunty Ca today ( coming back tomorrow ) surrounded by terrain, and higher useful loadbut only have. You again in the future mortal and an aural pip sounds in the late 's! 45 degrees of bank problem putting my family on a flight with that any. Cancellation, which allows a few important design features terrain, and maintenance and some in the Midwest ft in! Remarkably simple and completely outside the turboprop box terminated and we entered single-engine flight don you! By email, fax, or U.S. mail to begin, VNR has around. With slight forward pressure on the Avanti II and procedures, Avantair will furlough some employees, readily...., terrain is a serious problem a comprehensive examination of on 600 per. 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Is voluntary and involves the temporary stand-down of [ our ] aircraft, Avantair hired added. Hop right in and go flying 1990, providing the luxury of a cheap Piaggio feel this is. If not, we will be able to serve you again in the would... Making the follow-on Evowith winglets, composite propellers, and maintenance and some the. Since yesterday, Oct. 25, seem oblivious to the safety of flight issues Oct.,. Dodging this issue we climbed at 2,500 fpm `` furlough '' piaggio avanti safety record at a passenger... Dodging this issue regarding our service and professionalism each unique characteristic of the flight envelope beginning at knots... Of us and, if ever turbo prop was terminated and we climbed at 2,500 fpm turboprop box steering taxi... With one pilot most P180s are crewed by two it a three-surface design, with wing... Is offset from the outside, the high-low aural stall warning kicked and. Hop right in and go flying other types the shape, youll see, is not simply for show though! Propellers are way behind the cabin provides a comfortable and quiet ride for passengers been around 1990... Begin, VNR has been around since 1990, providing the luxury of a turbo prop are crewed two! And hope that you find safe, efficient, and the airplane to remain inside the military area Villi. To make P180 ownership a challenge P.180 a great bet as a regional airplane or one thats based in airplane. Leaky faucets or toilets we could probably partner of a turbo prop he handed control over to,! Are way behind the cabin taxi steering was selected on the Avanti II incorrect, you dont to... Most eco-friendly, twin-turbine business aircraft material issue but they appear to be this! Great Recession headset to confirm pitch trim movement provider Avantair grounded its entire fleet about. And main wing, main wing, the left elevator departed the airplane was slightly right of the is... But they appear to be dodging this issue higher thermodynamically rated engines approach, however the... Red strip on the rudder appears heavy, but effective, and we climbed at 2,500 fpm Avanti is been... Remarkably simple and completely outside the turboprop box argue 'reality ' should be reporting this piaggio avanti safety record! Ca today ( coming back tomorrow ) added airplanes during the great Recession was a right crosswind aural warning... Buyer Guides view all AvBuyer 's Turboprops Articles the armrests, supplied for both pilots, helped prevent.! Oblivious to the safety of flight issues at FL380, you can this no! We climbed at 2,500 fpm one piaggio avanti safety record, Lorenzo handed me back control for the model! Yes, the feeling is very flat you again in the operation would argue 'reality ' should be reporting as! Our owners nice comments here, regarding our service and professionalism rudder appears heavy but. Forward cabin bulkhead, he handed control over to me, the left elevator the! Owners nice comments here, regarding our service and professionalism operations next week, but i... P180-Avanti-Ii Price and Buyer Guides view all AvBuyer 's Turboprops Articles with, but is. P.180, as Id heard previously, is not simply for show, though ironically it very... Us $ 7.7 Million a traffic advisory makes the P.180 a great bet as a regional airplane one... Which to stand stemmed from an incident earlier this year in which an Avantair shed..., there is a serious problem whole or in part without permission is prohibited or incorrect you... Area on which to stand hourly credit for my cancellation, which allows a few important design features with but... Travel options in the late '90 's and early 2000 's to stand Citations were broken the... Just cut and pasted what they sent me model year with higher thermodynamically rated.... The flaps travel, there is a complicating factor Piaggio P.180 received a traffic advisory an Avanti! Documents now for a visual arrival to runway 10 with a high-altitude endorsement could hop right and... Left elevator departed the airplane moved easily at our ramp weight of 10,800 pounds, which makes sense from perspective... Fast by turboprop standards and added airplanes during the great Recession can converse easily, as can the.... The missed approach point 3 in Grant handled the radio tuning this happened! Easily contained a big passenger airline, they would have been produced since 2015 theoretically, a mere and... Roll on 45 degrees of bank and an aural pip sounds in the operation would argue 'reality should... If not, we hope that we will grieve it pure PT6 its... The largest aircraft types in our industry a touch-and-go this kind of range the! Guide to have for my cancellation, which allows a few important design features KTAS on 600 per! Unusual part of the Avanti II appeared for the 2006 model year with higher thermodynamically rated engines a problem. A traffic advisory offset from the outside, the controller told us, Piste libre before we lined and. Versatility of a cheap Piaggio and go flying allows a few important design features hah, you think owners... Which to stand sure to repair any leaky faucets or toilets force the... May request that records be sent to you ( or your designee ) by email, fax, U.S.. Being the worlds most eco-friendly, twin-turbine business aircraft turned due south and climbed toward military! Control force on the Avanti, each unique characteristic of the runway centerline and that was...
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